Attention Atheists.

so how long do you think that the world has been around for?

We do see it, and there are many examples.

Bacteria kept reproducing, until one misformed to live with two cells attached, instead of one. This became the first of the multi-cellular organisms.

Some time later, the first vertebrates formed in the seas, a little creature related to the lancelet. If you look at a lancelet, it's very fishlike, and so the process continued. Eventually, the first amphibians (such as Ichthyostega) walked on land, and some became reptiles. Reptiles split into three groups: modern reptiles, synapsids(mammal-like), and dinosaurs (which became birds).

And don't bring up the whole "If humans evolved from monkeys, why are there monkeys?" thing, because you (and others who believe this point is valid) have to understand that not all animals will evolve.

EDIT: And the Earth has been proven to be around 4 billion years old.

This post has been edited by Pip Bernadotte on Jul 22 2008, 11:32 AM

T-rex lives 65 million years ago.

The world has been around for a while indeediedo.

a number line is infinite but you can choose a specific point on it

basically if you look at the cyclic universe theory



the time we're used to is based on when our big bang happened, but that doesn't rule out time itself existing before that

This post has been edited by Xgoff on Jul 22 2008, 11:38 AM

I thought that this theory was disproven because of physical laws or some **** in the 1930s?

We have. Evolution and speciation have been observed. Creationists and other disbelievers in evolution keep upping the requirement; currently we're on phylum.

And in no way does "Bacteria -> Fish" make sense. Ever.

My view is that it's beyond me, but I'm pretty confident in all of the evidence we have towards life evolving and stuff. Where it began? I'm sure there are theories and evidence but I haven't looked into them, but I don't think some dude 'made' it or anything like that, otherwise where did he come from?

You mean God?

I'm not religious, but the whole point is that he was always there.

ah ok, see no one ever told me that.
i thought everything was expected to evolve, just at different rates.

If God can always be there, why can't the universe?

What's the point of adding God into it?

It's just an extra step that you don't need.

I think the real way is actually much more complicated than we can comprehend. Nothing was before time. You have to think about things that you don't know.

Actually, I'm pretty sure we technically didn't "evolve" from Monkeys, per se. We just share a common ancestor. The monkeys you see today aren't old animals that didn't evolve, they're just a kind of animal that evolved in a different way than us.

I think all animals DO evolve, unless they have no reason to. But as long as Natural Selection is allowed to occur, so will evolution.

I am a philosopher of freeform religion. I'm not sure what to call it.

I think that existence came to be through paradox. The Japanese element 'void', I think, refers to the paradox by which all things exist; all elements come from it and all elements return into it.
It is through this paradox that the concept of will came to be. It manifested itself into a form which would create this universe we know.

I agree that evolution happened and is happening now, though I think it was also guided so that living creatures would eventually become intelligent.

It's very gradual. The process you just said was filled with many changes over time. Also, notice how people have generally gotten taller over time. Or your dog has a useless vestigial toe. Small things.

Example of existence=existence.

You exist because your mother existed to give birth to you.

Actually, isn't the reason that monkeys and humans coexist not because we evolved from monkeys, but because monkeys and ourselves had a common ancestor?

yup, read my posts a few pages back.

This post has been edited by FuzzMaster on Jul 22 2008, 03:44 PM

You know what I meant by that; i.e. great whites are virtually unchanged since the Megalodon was around, etc.

OK now prove that for all things. Including energy.

law of conservation of?

ChaosEmerl, I agree with you, but I'll try to explain how it works for both christianity and science.

God is beyond time, space and matter - he doesn't need any of them to exist, there was no point in time he was created because he doesn't exist in time, it's like, there's no past, present or future for God, which is why in the bible the future is predicted. He already knows everything of the universe, not bound by time, space or matter.

Imagine a painter with a blank canvas, and he paints three blobs, a green blob, a blue blob, and a red blob. Before those blobs were there, he was still looking over a blank canvas, just because there was no picture, didn't mean the painter didn't exist.

I know comparing paint colour with time, space and matter isn't quite a perfect example, but it's just about our minds expecting everything to be relying on these main aspects of everything. The fundamental building bricks of the universe. Maybe there is more beyond what we understand, maybe that is God?

Although, here's why I think what I've just said is flawed.

If God was always there, before the universe was, which we can prove wasn't always there. (if the universe was infinate, we would have never reached this point in time, if I promised to give you some candy after and infinate amount of time, would I ever give you it? No. An infinate amount of time before now is IMPOSSIBLE)

Okay, fair enough, but why would God wait to create the universe? If God was infinate, then that would mean the universe was also infinate, because God would have no reason to wait to create the universe, he would atomatically know all the flaws and pros in creating one, everything that would ever happen (such as knowing the future). So as soon as God was around so would the universe have to be. If not, God is not perfect, and is bound by reason and thought. Which ISN'T the God describe in the bible.